9 Replies Last post: May 20, 2005 11:55 PM by Otto von Wachter  
Francesco Bellomi Newbie 61 posts since
Aug 21, 2002
Currently Being Moderated

Nov 16, 2004 10:31 PM

Prototype

Hi all,

 

I really enjoyed reanding the article, and basically agree with the whole vision presented there. I work as a software architect, and I already use a LOP perspective while developing software frameworks, even if I currently use only pure java to write them.

 

I'm eager to test the prototype/plugin, but I could not find it on http://www.jetbrains.com/mps/index.html

Rob Harwood Apprentice 896 posts since
Sep 10, 2002
Currently Being Moderated
Nov 16, 2004 11:16 PM in response to: Francesco Bellomi
Re: Prototype

This was old text from a previous draft of the article when we weren't sure what would be available on the MPS site. It was supposed to be removed, but slipped through the cracks. Our apologies.

 

There will be a prototype in the coming months, but it is not ready yet. We will correct the online version of the article as soon as possible.

 

Regards,

Rob Harwood

Jens Voss Novice 405 posts since
Oct 7, 2002
Currently Being Moderated
Nov 19, 2004 10:56 AM in response to: Rob Harwood
Re: Prototype

There will be a prototype in the coming

months, but it is not ready yet. We will correct the

online version of the article as soon as possible.

 

Sergey, does it make sense to look at the MPS100 prototype from one year ago which is on your blog? (Of course, I did look at it already.) I mean, does what you are working on currently still have anything to do with that old version?

If so, to me it looks like your old prototype covers only the "semantics" part of LOP, not the "editor" or "structure" aspects, is that correct? Will that be different in the prototype that you plan to release soon?

 

Anyway, I think it looks extremely promising.

 

Best regards,

Jens

Sergey Dmitriev JetBrains 263 posts since
Oct 12, 2001
Currently Being Moderated
Nov 16, 2004 11:18 PM in response to: Francesco Bellomi
Re: Prototype

That is what we are actualy planning as the next step - we'll open the early access to MPS. We just need some time to clean it up. You can subscribe to RSS feed on this page to be notified about that.

Michael Damberger Apprentice 792 posts since
Aug 20, 2002
Currently Being Moderated
Nov 17, 2004 8:32 PM in response to: Francesco Bellomi
Re: Prototype

The article really reads VERY interesting!

But theory is gray, so I'm eagerly waiting for any kind of prototype / the IDEA plugin

 

Some problems there might be:

- when looking at foreign MPS code, you have to understand the languages the other developer has designed. It will be important that languages are well designed, e.g. like usage of operator overloading etc.

-  Will it be easy to migrate my code, when I want to switch towards a better DSL (if somebody wrote a better DSL for the same problem that I wrote one for)

 

 

Best regards,

Michael

 

 

 

Sergey Dmitriev JetBrains 263 posts since
Oct 12, 2001
Currently Being Moderated
Nov 17, 2004 8:56 PM in response to: Michael Damberger
Re: Prototype

- when looking at foreign MPS code, you have to understand the languages the other developer has designed. It will be important that languages are well designed, e.g. like usage of operator overloading etc.

 

It is the same as with class libraries - you need to learn it before using it. But in LOP the environment (editor) will help you to use new language - by providing languge-specific editor actions, autocompletion, refactorings, etc. And our experience shows that languages are much easier to learn then libraries, because they can be made much closer to the way people think about the problem domain.

 

- Will it be easy to migrate my code, when I want to switch towards a better DSL (if somebody wrote a better DSL for the same problem that I wrote one for)

 

The fact that programs in MPS are represented as trees and graphs means that you will not need to write parser for such transformation.

We also will provide special language that will allow to query/browse/change programs written in MPS, so yo can write these transformation scripts on a very high level, much easier then using existing approach, i.e. like source code API in IntelliJ IDEA.

So we'll make such kind transformation easier, at least it will become possible in MPS. Now for example it is almost impossible to transform UI code written in Java Swing to .Net's WinForms.

Michael Damberger Apprentice 792 posts since
Aug 20, 2002
Currently Being Moderated
Nov 17, 2004 11:14 PM in response to: Sergey Dmitriev
Re: Prototype

well, I really can't wait for the EAP !!

 

"couple of months" sounds like we have to wait way into

second quarter of 2005 ?

Miles Parker Newbie 14 posts since
Jan 20, 2005
Currently Being Moderated
Apr 9, 2005 8:22 PM in response to: Francesco Bellomi
Re: Prototype

Please??

Otto von Wachter Newbie 38 posts since
Jan 15, 2004
Currently Being Moderated
May 20, 2005 11:55 PM in response to: Michael Damberger
Re: Prototype

well, I really can't wait for the EAP !!

 

 

me too!

 

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